Muse 2 + Dev

Ummm, if you write your own app from scratch, I don’t see why!? If you use their SDK, let me know as I didn’t think it’s working for muse2…

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Because it still uses the Muse hardware

No, I don’t think that’s correct. If you used their SDK, yes, but I can’t perceive what legislation would grant a company permission over any software that accessed their hardware. Just think about it. Have you read this somewhere or just assumed?

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Well on the one hand the license only applies when using the SDK, but on the other hand AFAIK you have to get Interaxon’s permissions before using the Muse hardware in a commercial application, otherwise I assume they would have the app pulled from the iOS/Android app store.

Again, no. Why would you think that? I can write software to interact with all sorts of hardware. It doesn’t require the hardware manufacturers permission. Again, have you read this somewhere or are you just assuming it based on…?

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Of course you can write it, but getting it in the app store is an entirely different matter. Since you’d be circumventing Interaxon’s licensing and payment structure, it certainly seems like they would request that the app be removed from the app store. How Apple or Google have responded in similar situations I have no idea.

Right, I’ll try one last time. Have you read this somewhere?

Interaxon would have nothing to do with someone buying a muse device and using some software with it (apart from making and selling the muse). Hardware isn’t licensed in that way (apart from certain parts of mobile phones) and it’s not actionable against the software creator. They could say the muse owner breached some terms and conditions and therefore was no longer under warranty, for example. The kind of licensing you are referring to would apply to an SDK (which I wish they’d fix!).

Apple and Google shouldn’t pull developers work based on say so and there aren’t any license breaches to action, are there? Did you read some somewhere?

I don’t have a C++ solution, but am pretty happy with this Java-based one.

I’m using Muse Direct (annual fee) and Muse Monitor (one-time charge) to stream Muse data: Muse headband -> iPhone -> laptop. On my laptop, I’m running a custom Java program using the OscP5 library to process the data. There is also an OSC Data Monitor tool available that lets you easily see what events (“addresses”) are being sent from the Muse.

The OscP5 library is designed to be used with the Processing IDE, but I just use the Processing libraries within my normal development environment (IntelliJ IDEA).

Tim

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What works on muse 2 ?! It seems to me there is only one application that I can use so I start to think about returning the hardware … :frowning:

Just wondering if you found a solution? These messages suggest is tricky to do much new or personalised stuff with a Muse2?

I’ve spent a few hours trying to get https://pypi.org/project/muselsl/ to work but still have hope. I’m just not very good at down and dirty bluetooth linux stuff so it’s taking me a bit. There are quite a few issues and quite a few forks, and it’s was May when there was last a commit, but I’m holding on to hope!

I’ve built reliable apps on linux, the muse-lsl was an enormous help.

For all the reasons stated above, and more, Interaxon has made a huge mistake in locking down the SDK. I’ve seen this blow up for other companies. And I’ve seen companies thrive and build a community by making the SDK available and free. The best example I can point to is Houdini, a procedural visual effects application that has a tight knit community of developers. I’m proud to be one of the engineers that helped bring the HDK (Houdini Development Kit) into the hands of academics, researchers and of course the film community. ( http://www.sidefx.com )

Empowering people to engage in your company’s products in an asset, not a liability.

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I just wanna say WHAT THE F**K! I bought the Muse 2 with the hope that I could stream and analyse some data but it seems like Interaxion is trying to make that as hard as possible. No SDK, all links to the apps are broken or do not support the new Muse 2, I can only stream data using my android because someone else built a monitor for it??? What the hell is wrong with you. I will urge any developer to return their device and certainly spread the word in my research community that they should avoid the Muse and opt for other options that don’t cripple development and research. Like Neurosky. JUST SAYING!

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hi there,
thought I would chime in just to agree with your frustration.
It is pretty sad tbh, but it honestly looks like they are short of money to spend on things other than pure revenue generation to keep their investors happy and the company afloat.
They are trying to become the mass market lifestyle product which they initially pitched Muse as. They have pushed a decent amount of product but I dont think it ever became a viral hit. I mean look at the engagement on their official twitter account, less than 20k followers and no one comments or likes their daily tweets. Mid size twitch game streamers have a more engagement (and often higher sub counts).

So i believe that DIY and the technical community is now secondary or tertiary in their plans since it has not been and will not be a huge source of revenue or referrals.

If you look at their recent moves, they have:

  • moved the official moderated forum from forum.choosemuse.com to facebook (which I would never join, Facebook is so 2018).
  • pushed their subscription based guided meditation service
  • released the new headband for sleep last week to keep the hardware cycle money inflow alive

On the other hand, they have stopped everything which seems to be more technical unless working directly with researchers (which would be private comms)

  • SDK release
  • moderation of this forum (i mean i cant find a link to this forum on the main choosemuse site. You can only find the forum if you search through Google)

It is what it is. BTW, i think there is a SDK for muse 2 but they just dont release it to everyone. I mean, the Muse Monitor / Mind Monitor guy has developed a Muse 2 compatible app and it seems updated except for the PPG. How else would he have developed it.

Anyway, rant over. Have a nice day all :slight_smile:

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It is pretty sad tbh, but it honestly looks like they are short of money to spend on things other than pure revenue generation to keep their investors happy and the company afloat.
They are trying to become the mass market lifestyle product which they initially pitched Muse as.

I think it is sound for our market-based economy to have an obligation to circulate money to investors and employees.

On the other hand, the more successful MUSE is as a commodity product, the more likely it is that cheaper Chinese-made copy products will emerge and that lower prices will be the weapon to begin eroding the market.

If such anxious future image becomes reality, looking at the recent situation in Hong Kong, there will be no doubt that the ultimate personal information called electroencephalogram data will be downloaded to a Chinese company’s database.

Although it is a personal wish, I hope that Muse, based on sound marketism with insight into personal information protection, will continue to offer sound services to users.
++++

投資家と従業員にお金を循環させる義務を負うことは我々の市場主義経済では健全なことだと思います。

その一方でMUSEがコモディディ商品として成功すればするほど、低価格の中国製のコピー商品が出現し、低価格を武器にして市場を侵食し始める可能性も高まります。

香港の近況を見るに、脳波データという究極の個人情報が中国企業のデータベースに吸い上げられることには大きな不安を抱かざるを得ません。

個人的な願いではありますが、個人情報保護に見識のある健全な市場主義に立脚したMuseには、今後ともユーザーへの健全なサービスを期待したいと願っています。

Still here, still grumpy. It really dented my enthusiasm to try anything.

If anyone gets a decent sensible library working, report back here! :+)

It’s one of the most short sided decisions for Interaxon to make. The developer forum here has the most posts, that says something significant. Why would a company turn away enthusiasts and promoters? Their complaint of not having enough time is truly weak, that’s the sign of bad management. I know, worked in so many companies and know these symptoms are from an out of touch company.

I hear from people and developers all the time asking the same questions. It’s the main reason I haven’t invested in more Muse devices. Really short-sided and historically telling of internal chaos and a faltering company. Been there, seen that, so many times.

Just replicated what JTKorb mentioned on my mac just now and it works. Install the OSC Data Monitor first and then copy the Oscp5 directory underneath the 1st app to the directory it mentions in the readme (processing/libraries/…et cetera

Interested in replicating this process, was just wondering how you used the data in Processing?

I am working with artist Petronio Bendito to create visualizations of live Muse data streams. We did a demo of our work in progress at the Purdue “2050 Conference of the Future” (see ArtWaves) last fall. There is a short video posted on Petronio’s Instagram page.